- cross-posted to:
- news@beehaw.org
- globalnews@lemmy.zip
- cross-posted to:
- news@beehaw.org
- globalnews@lemmy.zip
Former Israeli Knesset member Moshe Feiglin quoted Adolf Hitler as he called for Israel to resettle the Gaza Strip and create a “Hebrew Gaza.”
Feiglin, who quit Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s Likud Party to found the right-wing Zehut Party and plans to challenge Likud in Israel’s next elections, made the comments during a panel discussion on Israel’s Channel 12 that was shared on social media on Sunday, as Middle East Eye reported.
“We are not guests in our country, this is our country, all of it…” Feiglin said, adding, “As Hitler said, ‘I cannot live if one Jew is left.’ We can’t live here if one ‘Islamo-Nazi’ remains in Gaza.”
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… does he not see the irony in calling the other guys nazis while directly (and knowingly) quoting Hitler?
You want the truth or you want to keep what’s left of your faith in humanity?
It’s not directed at you or me or most others, it’s a rallying cry to his supporters.
I’d call it a dog-whistle but he said all of it out loud.
It’s the same projection play that the GOP and Russia use. Antifa are fascists. LGBTQ+ people are oppressing us. Ukrainians are Nazis, let’s abduct all their children.
wait, he ACTUALLY SAID HE’S QUOTING HITLER???
when i read the title i thought he said something identical or very similar to something Hitler said maybe without knowing… all fascism leads to the same destination after all, you don’t need to be deliberate about it. (remember how people said TFG was quoting hitler and he said, and i paraphrase, “i didn’t know he said it i just came up with the same conclusion on my own” as if that doesn’t make it worse… kinda like that)
but NO! he literally quotes Hitler by attributing the quote to Hitler without a modicum of irony. dude the israeli government has gone do far deep into fascism that they can’t even use the thinnest veils as cover.
Coming from a country which had a Fascist dictatorship until the 70s, I’ve started calling Zionism ethno-Facism, because it’s a far more rabidly racist strain than most Fascist dictatorships and unlike almost all of the others which were mainly Nationalist, claims to represent an entire ethnicity and justifies even their used of the most extreme violence as some kind life or death fight for the defense of their ethnicity.
Fascism as seens in places like Spain, Portugal, Greece or even Italy was mainly Nationalist (still authocratic, repressive and violent) and never anywhere as racist or violent as the kind of Fascism that includes claims of racial superiority and representing a whole ethnicity.
Amongst Fascists in Europe it’s only the Nazis that claimed, like the Zionists do, that they represented an entire ethnicity, who similarly committed extreme genocidal violence against specific ethnicities whilst claiming it was all in defense of their own ethnicity and who in the same way claimed than critci sm of their acts was being against that ethnicity.
Any Fascism is bad, but ethno-Fascism adds to it the whole layer of ethnicity and hence is far more cold, calously violent and genocidal when it comes to other ethnicities - think Ku-Klux-Klan crossed with Fascism.
Yeah, his take seems to be “Hitler was right, races can’t coexist, if only he had been Jewish” from that quote.
He has never been part of Israel’s government.
Like I wrote in another comment, he was 36th on the Likud’s list 10 years ago, and later founded a party that didn’t even get 1 mandate.Yeah, he obviously can’t be a very good politician if he’s going around telling the truth like that
i shouldn’t have used the word “government” as what i meant was more along the lines of Israeli politics in general. not that the government itself is much better, they just haven’t name checked Hitler as much yet.
although natenyahu already has engaged in apologia for Hitler himself so it’s not far off anyway.
Wow, Bibi wasn’t quite far right enough for this Jewish Nazi. And fucking ironic he’s talking about ‘Islamo-Nazi’ s.
Pretty much the entirety of the Zionist propaganda follows the same ethno-Fascist lines as the Nazis stuff, from the “chosen people” and them claiming to represent a whole ethnicity to their claims that their agressive murderous violence along ethnic lines is “defense” and even calling anybody who criticizes their violence as being against their race, in the case of Zionists by calling the “anti-semites” whilst the Nazis would say that such critics were “against the Arian Race”.
Most of what the Zionists say is just Nazi propaganda with “Arian Race” replaced by “Jewish People” and “against the Arian Race” replaced by “anti-semite”.
So one kind a member of an ethno-Fascist ideology - a Zionist - directly quoting the leader of another ethno-Fascist ideology such as Hiltler, is not at all surprising.
It does seem like the TL;DR of right wing Israelis is “Hitler was right, but his only problem was that he was killing us.”
Looks like they choose themselves. Nobody chose them.
Here’s a reminder that the right wing Zionist used to work with the Nazis, some of them even after the war starts.
Source?
You might try reading a bit about the Revisionist Zionist movment. Particularly the IZL (Irgun) and the Lehi (Stern Group). There are tons of great books on this. I’d recommend The Zionist Revisionism from Jabotinsky to Shamir by Lenni Brenner
Yeah, sounds like a great recommendation.
It is a great recommendation you should definitely check it out.
The Story Of Lehi, The Jewish Terrorist Organization That Tried To Form An Alliance With The Nazis
He took Jabotinsky’s idea of a mass exodus of European Jews to Palestine and crafted an outlandish proposal: in return for Lehi swearing their allegiance to the Axis Powers, Stern wanted all Jews under the Nazi administration to be transferred to Palestine, 40,000 of whom would be immediately armed and trained to rebel against the British authorities.
Lehi’s members obtained key roles in israeli politics later on, such as one of their leaders Yitzhak Shamir which became prime minister of israel.
The claim was “the right wing Zionist used to work with the Nazis”. The “source” is describing
- a splinter group (that was opposed by other Zionists)
- trying to get an agreement with the Nazis
- that would allow all Jews to leave the Nazi territories
Of course the right wing was opposed by other Zionists. They were radical fascists. That’s why I said right wing (the minority) and not all of them. The problem is the right wing is now the majority. Revisionist Zionists control Israel today. They did far more than try to get agreements and it was for way more than for Jews to leave Nazi territory. Stern was hoping to get Nazi backing to attack the British in Palestine and to help prop up the fascist ethno-state that would be established.
I’m not familiar with the factions in Zionism, but according to Wikipedia they were opposed by other revisionist Zionists, e.g. Ze’ev Jabotinsky. Also: still no sources
I did give you a source, you just didn’t respond to that comment for some reason.
Also I’m not sure why you think what you’re saying is inconsistent with what I said. The revisionist zionists worked with the Nazis and fascists in Italy. Then after the war started a splinter group continued to work with a Nazis, although there is evidence to say that the other group was also still working with the Nazis. Since you already read Wikipedia you must have seen that part.
Since you were unfamiliar with the factions of Zionism I suggest you learn about them and that would make you better able to have these discussions. Though keep in mind they’re all friendly with fascists left and right. Because Zionism is inherently a fascist principle.
You mean this source?
Opposed? Lehi’s members became big politicians in what would later become israel.
I have slightly edited my previous comment to include a bit more detail but here’s israeli Prime minister and leader of what used to be Lehi Yitzhak Shamir
There’s much more. What’s important to know is that Lehi while not the biggest organisation they were extremely violent. At the time they had massive impact on the direction of israel. Their radical Zionism played a big part in shaping israel and their “the end justifies the means” approach can clearly be observed to this day.
Bonus meme: Lehi also ran the newspaper Hamaas
Opposed?
Yes, opposed: “These appeals to Germany were in direct opposition to the views of other Zionists, such as Ze’ev Jabotinsky, who wanted Britain to defeat the Nazis even as they wanted to expel the British from Palestine.” Source
What’s important to know is that Lehi while not the biggest organisation they were extremely violent.
No, for the question of “the right wing Zionists working with the Nazis” it is not important. You can be extremely violent without working with Nazis…
Their radical Zionism played a big part in shaping israel and their “the end justifies the means” approach can clearly be observed to this day.
This may well be, but is also not the same as working with Nazis.
Bonus meme: Lehi also ran the newspaper Hamaas
Also no relevance for the question of working with Nazis.
I like the part where you fully ignored a Lehi leader becoming the Prime Minister of israel
Mentioned on page 94 (Chapter 4) of 10 Myths About Israel by Ilan Pappé. To be straight forward with you I couldn’t find the primary source of this statement in there but I think it’s in one of his previous books which are all referenced as sources for this chapter. In general, Pappé is considered credible by the academic community except by Zionists of course, though their opinion on this topic doesn’t count for much imo.
Internet archive is apparently somewhat of with the pages, page 94 seems to be in a different chapter there.
Scanning chapter 4 however, the only mention of collaboration with the Nazis is “[Hajj Amin al-Husayni]'s willingness to serve as a radio commentator for the Nazis and to help recruit Muslims in the Balkans to the German war effort no doubt stains his career. But he did not act any differently from the Zionist leaders in the 1930s, who themselves sought an alliance with the Nazis against the British Empire, or from all the other anticolonialist movements who wanted rid of the Empire by way of alliances with its principal enemies.” (page 65 on the archive)
This seems like a rather unspecific source for “right wing Zionist used to work with the Nazis, some of them even after the war starts.” (not to mention that njm1314 somehow forgot to mention that at least Palestinian leader also wanted an alliance with the Nazis and actually worked for/with them).
I’m starting to think that njm1314 is not as well known fact as they make it out to be…
Sorry, I have the ebook and in there it’s page 94. Here are the references, as said no primary source but he’s referring to his previous books and it may just be trivial to reference at this point. But I’m not from the field and haven’t read every book of him. In general though as I said he is considered credible by the academic community except Zionists.
The relationship of the Palestinian Mufti is also discussed in more detail in the same chapter. Highly recommend reading the whole book.
If you’re really keen on verifying this maybe just write a mail to Pappé? In my experience professors actually do answer to such questions.
I used to kid about “You know, it’s only a matter if time before someone starts talking about a 'final solution to ‘the Palestinian problem’.” And yet, here we are…
After the war and genocide the Palestinians will need a homeland. I say we give them Norwich and arm them to displace the English
There’s actually a really good alternate history novel along those lines, after WWII, instead of Israel, they were given Sitka, Alaska.
The Yiddish Policemen’s Union
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Yiddish_Policemen's_Union
The Coen Brothers were attached to turn it into a movie but nothing came of it. :(
it’s got a rebbe mob boss? Neat
Really fun characters all through the book.
They have become the thing they hate.
I get the impression with a lot of Israeli politicians, they didn’t hate the Nazis so much as they hated being the out-group of the Nazis. Since, as soon as they were able to establish a foothold of power they’ve largely followed the same playbook, but with themselves as the “Master Race” and everybody else as the vermin to exterminate.
Fascist thought is perfectly compatible between countries of different races. The philosophy is the “right” type of people should expel (or murder) undesirable minorities and take the resources they need. If those minorities go somewhere else and oppress some other people, that’s just how the world is supposed to work when it’s not corrupted by things like equal rights or respect for personal freedom. It’s how Aryan-supremacist Germany had no issues allying with Japan. They both believed in a world order where it was the natural state of things for racially homogeneous states to dominate lesser races and claim the resources for their people. Because they’re just better, and all the problems are from race-mixing and kowtowing to the undeserving.
One of the early anti-Jewish efforts by the Nazis (promoted now by some Israeli politicians for Palestinians) was encouraging Jews migrate somewhere else, Israel being one of the common destinations.
Zionists collaborated with the Nazis to try and create a Zionist Palestine, very early on. This is well documented.
Zionists collaborated with the Nazis to try and create a Zionist Palestine, very early on. This is well documented.
I mean, Likud is the successor organization to the original Zionists, so they’ve always been genocidal ethno-fascists. But this guy decided to form his own party because Likud apparently wasn’t ethno-fascist enough for him.
The “original zionists” were socialist and communists who tried to do things in the way of cooperation and peace, and were a defensive group.
The offensive groups splintered off the original one after Arab riots and massacres of Jews.
I’m most surprised by how little this development surprised me.
How anti-semitic of him
Seems like a nut.
Also he’s not in office. It’s kinda like getting upset if George Santos said something insane.
I get that people are working hard to find evidence for the “Israel = Nazis” narrative that’s currently trending, but kinda scraping the bottom of the barrel aren’t we?
Or, here’s another way of looking at it. Man who voluntarily left the ruling party of Israel and remains a part of Israel’s political class quotes Hitler. Not in the way we all quote Hitler to show that a point of view is wrong because Hitler held it, but rather in the way we quote someone like Nelson Mandela or Albert Einstein; to support an argument because we respect the source.
Meaning, Israeli politician respects Hitler.Israel=Nazis is trending because the Israeli regime is genocidal, just like the Nazi regime that necessitated the creation of Israel, which is tragically ironic. This news piece is just garnish.
I see people constantly invoking the Nazis to make excuses for the actions of Hamas. The logic is “Israel is like Nazis therefore everything Hamas does it permissible.” It’s idiotic reasoning but it’s commonplace here.
This guy is similarly idiotic. If you’re outraged by what this guy is saying, look at the rationalizations people on here do everyday in support of Hamas. It’s the same eye for an eye kind of thinking. “Other side is Nazis, therefore we should do horrible things!”
It’s not supporting Hamas to point out that Israel is doing horrible things.
I guess you just pretend not to see comments all over Lemmy expressing support for Hamas?
I’m definitely seeing more comments in full support of Israels actions in Gaza
Doesn’t mean there isn’t support for Hamas abounds.
They seem like immature TikTok kids from what I can tell, but they’re around.
Oh definitely. I’m just saying both sides have their indiscriminant supporters and that one side is way overrepresented in my experience
I read newspapers in several languages and see your strawman in comments all over the world: Criticizing Israel means supporting Hamas.
In reality pretty much everyone is explicitly not supporting Hamas terrorists while arguing for a stop to the Israeli atrocities.
Ex Likud members which used to be part of the Knesset that are now running their own party and saying this stuff on mainstream israeli TV channels does indicate something.
Unless they arrested this guy for saying literal Nazi shit on TV of course. Surely israel would do that right.
You think people should be arrested for mentioning Nazis?
Israel is currently jailing any Arab which posts anything on social media which the state does not condone.
Arabs in Israel face reprisals over online solidarity with Gaza
The Palestinian singer Dalal Abu Amneh was arrested briefly this week when she went to a police station to file a complaint after receiving hundreds of death threats. Rather than investigating her complaint, police detained her because of a comment she posted on Facebook, said her lawyer, Abir Bakr.
“They put cuffs on her hands and feet, and subjected her to insults and humiliation. They want to frighten people and teach them a lesson through Dalal,” Bakr said. After the start of Israel’s bombardment of Gaza, Abu Amneh had posted “there is no victor but Allah” alongside a Palestinian flag on her Facebook page.
Invoking literal Hitler in a context that literally calls for literal Genocide on mainstream TV, does call into question if there are any double standards present here.
Now that antisemitism isn’t a problem anymore for israel either since they’re literally quoting Hitler it’s getting pretty obvious that israel is just doing Nazi Germany and white power.
Here you are claiming antisemitism isn’t a problem in the same sentence where you’re implying all Jews are just like the worst one you can find.
As you are a known israel defender I’m not going to bother with this extremely antisemitic comment but defending Nazism is a new low for you.
I’m known? Cool!
See the difference between you and I is that I attribute the actions on October 7 to Hamas, not the Palestinian people. But you see any Israeli doing something wrong you use it to paint everyone in Israel as being that way.
You can split hairs about whether that’s antisemitism, but I don’t care. When you see one person of an ethnicity and/or religious group doing something wrong and then go on to say “they” do things like that, you’re showing what kind of person you are.
You keep describing israelis as “Jews”. A description israel itself rejects as it claims it is secular.
So somehow is both “Jewish”, but also “secular”, But also somehow also has Palestinians if Apartheid needs to be defended.
Time is a flat circle and irony is dead
…and there it is.
Whats with all these Judea-Nazis in Israel?
If you think any of this is new I have a Nakba to sell you.
