• PugJesus@lemmy.worldOP
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      14
      arrow-down
      9
      ·
      6 months ago

      As a citizen, it’s my duty to speak out against what I feel are bad choices for the polity. I didn’t realize advocacy of voting for (or against) a specific candidate or issue through speech was so anti-democratic. I’m learning a lot from you today.

      • OccamsTeapot@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        11
        arrow-down
        11
        ·
        6 months ago

        You’re really leaning into this idea that I’m saying you’re being anti democratic. I thought I was clear but here goes:

        Having no choice but to vote for a genocide because of a two party system where both send bombs to Israel is not exactly democracy at it’s best.

        Brow beating leftists who take issue with this is “telling the proles how to vote.”

        These are two points. I hope that clears things up

        • PugJesus@lemmy.worldOP
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          9
          arrow-down
          10
          ·
          edit-2
          6 months ago

          Having no choice but to vote for a genocide because of a two party system where both send bombs to Israel is not exactly democracy at it’s best.

          Sure it is. A majority of both parties, and independents, have spent the past several months consistently approving of the current level of support of Israel, or else advocating for more support of Israel’s genocide.)

          That’s democracy, at its best. Representing the will of the majority.

          Just because the will of the majority is repugnant doesn’t make it not democracy, or “democracy” (implying that it is, in some way, not true democracy).

          Brow beating leftists who take issue with this is “telling the proles how to vote.”

          I’m sorry that you feel people other than you having opinions is so hurtful. I think it’s best to end this conversation here, to minimize the hurt I do to you.

          • dsemy@lemm.ee
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            8
            arrow-down
            1
            ·
            6 months ago

            Just because the will of the majority is repugnant doesn’t make it not democracy, or “democracy” (implying that it is, in some way, not true democracy).

            I agree with most of your points, but this is not true as the majority can easily make a nation undemocratic.

            A functioning democracy needs to ensure there is no tyranny of the majority.

            • PugJesus@lemmy.worldOP
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              5
              arrow-down
              7
              ·
              6 months ago

              The idea of a ‘tyranny of the majority’ is unrelated to whether or not a polity is a democracy, though you are correct that a majority can make a nation undemocratic. This is achieved, though, by removing the responsiveness of the government to popular opinion, not by popular opinion being in favor of (and achieving) dogshit oppression.

          • OccamsTeapot@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            9
            arrow-down
            7
            ·
            edit-2
            6 months ago

            Sure it is. A majority of both parties, and independents, have spent the past several months consistently approving of the current level of support of Israel, or else advocating for more support of Israel’s genocide.

            Didn’t we already have this conversation? 55% of all voters (more democrats) disapprove of the military’s actions: https://news.gallup.com/poll/642695/majority-disapprove-israeli-action-gaza.aspx

            You shared an older poll showing that people still thought in December that the US is sending the right amount of aid (edit: previously, not the one you edited in after this reply). People are stupid.

            That’s democracy, at its best. Representing the will of the majority.

            And ONLY the will of the majority? Are you fucking high? 🤣

            I’m sorry that you feel people other than you having opinions is so hurtful. I think it’s best to end this conversation here, to minimize the hurt I do to you.

            This is pathetic. I am not in the slightest bit “hurt” by this. Pretending that I am is a cheap way to imply you are being reasonable and I am being emotional. The fact is that you and many others have spent months insulting people who don’t want to vote for a genocide because you have set the bar at DONALD FUCKING TRUMP levels of low.

            If expecting better of Biden is so bad to you, maybe you are the one with the issue. But I’m not going to pretend you’re crying in your bed about it because I’m not a fucking schoolkid