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- politics@lemmy.world
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“You’ve gotten a lot of credit for emphasizing the humanity of Palestinians. But what I often hear from folks is that there is no policy change that either you or President Biden said you would do. Is there a policy change as president that you would do in our helping of Israel in this war?”
“We need to get this deal done,” Harris replied, “and we need to get it done immediately. And that is my position. And that is my policy.”
Daniels followed up. “But in the way that we send weapons and the way we interact as their ally, are there specific policy changes?”
Harris said that she was “entirely supportive” of the Biden administration’s decision to pause a shipment of weapons. She then quickly turned back to a need for a ceasefire agreement.
The line of questioning was the toughest Harris has faced on the issue, which remains a source of deep frustration among some Democratic voters over what they see as the party’s effort to push Gaza into the margins of political discourse. Harris’ answers on Tuesday, which relied heavily on boilerplate campaign points, are unlikely to quell that criticism.
Sorry how are those hard questions? Or just a sign of how little the press asks about it?
Well it’s obviously hard for Kamala or else she wouldn’t have weaseled around answering the question.
For current news, those were hard questions. I think just not accepting what the candidate says as facts and following up with detailed questions equals “hard questions” now.
Look how the news is treating Trumps mental decline compared to when his opponent was Biden.
“Toughest yet” doesn’t necessarily mean objectively very tough.
I’d like someone to ask them their thoughts on the recent evidence that Israel was selling the weapons we’ve given them to Russia. So in a way, we’re supporting Russia in their invasion of Ukraine at the same time we’re supporting a genocide.
Consensus candidate gives consensus answer on question that can only hurt her with the election weeks away.
That’s all there is to it. This is just not something we’re going to see her real thoughts on until after the election.
The US is currently aiding and abetting Israel’s genocide. If the Democrats switch course, like many Democratic voters want, it would significantly improve Harris’ support nationally, especially in swing states. The majority of voters, and a vast majority of Democratic voters, want a change in policy on Israel. Harris pivoting from Biden on this issue would significantly help her, not hurt her, when it comes to voters and voter turnout
Amnesty
In a new research briefing submitted to the U.S. government today as part of the National Security Memorandum on Safeguards and Accountability with Respect to Transferred Defense Articles and Defense Services (NSM-20) process, Amnesty International USA details civilian deaths and injuries with U.S.-made weapons, as well as other cases that highlight an overall pattern of unlawful attacks by Israeli forces. The briefing also details practices by Israeli forces inconsistent with best practices for mitigating civilian harm and provides clear examples of the misuse of defense articles, the commission of torture, and the use of unlawful lethal force. Lastly, the briefing also details the denial of humanitarian assistance to the civilian population of Gaza.
“It’s shocking that the Biden administration continues to hold that the government of Israel is not violating international humanitarian law with U.S.-provided weapons when our research shows otherwise and international law experts disagree,” said Amanda Klasing, National Director for Government Relations with Amnesty International USA. “The International Court of Justice found the risk of genocide in Gaza is plausible and ordered provisional measures. President Biden must end U.S. complicity with the government of Israel’s grave violations of international law and immediately suspend the transfer of weapons to the government of Israel.”
“The evidence is clear and overwhelming: the government of Israel is using U.S.-made weapons in violation of international humanitarian and human rights law, and in a manner that is inconsistent with U.S. law and policy, said Klasing. “In order to follow U.S. laws and policies, the United States must immediately suspend any transfer of arms to the government of Israel.”
Polls:
This took like 2 days to blow up. Wow. At any rate here’s some points.
A. Harris isn’t the one sending weapons. The VP in the US is largely powerless unless the President gives them something to do. Interestingly there’s a possibility her remarks earlier this year were meant to put pressure on Biden. (the ones where she seemed almost to take the Palestinians side) But it could also have been stuff she was sent to say to try and calm tensions.
B. The polling data supports her messaging strategy. At this point she is clearly courting conservatives who don’t like Trump. So her messaging strategy of, need a ceasefire/Israel has a right, is meant to not rock the boat.
This is why I call her a consensus candidate. I know that term gets used a lot to tar the democratic nominee the primary selects, but she is literally a consensus candidate. Blue dogs and moderates agreed to back her without a primary. She and her campaign team obviously believe she will lose more votes than she gains if she breaks that messaging line. The polling you supplied supports that younger and more left democrats want to see movement. But it doesn’t support that swing state voters won’t vote for her. The part that’s worst is that in Pennsylvania the line dips precipitously on exactly what they feel they need. This is why the White House has weekly messaging on having a cease fire and why they always blame Hamas for it failing. That’s the big thing people want.
For what it’s worth I want to see that movement too. I just don’t expect anything until after the election unless something big changes again. You’d think an American citizen being killed by a called shot while unarmed would do it but apparently not.
Edit to add, I forgot to add the reason PA is so important is up until a couple weeks ago it was the only state that mattered. Trump was seen as having sewn up enough other states that he only needed PA to win. So that has highly influenced the race. In a nutshell it doesn’t matter what the uncommitted movement in the Rust Belt says because without PA they don’t even get counted. Now of course the race has opened up but there’s no telling if that’s because of her strategy or if it was always going to open up.
Harris has not deviated her position compared to Biden’s current policy and I absolutely disagree with how you interpreted those polls. I think it’s much more about the sentiment of the donors than the voters that are influencing Harris’s position on this. I also stand on the notion that trying to court Republican voters by running away from the progressive base of the Democratic voters, is a bad idea politically and morally. That said, I do respect your opinion, Maggoty
I’ll edit this with info from the polls if I have time later
Oh the donors are certainly part of it. I don’t want to discount that. It’s just hard for me to write long form and get everything in. Her messaging trajectory though has been interesting. She did actually diverge this past spring, very softly. But over the summer as calls for Biden to step down intensified she started toeing the line.
I haven’t checked the veracity of reports like this, but I’ve heard this and it makes me think her vagueness has got to do with $$$, not votes.
Unfortunately, I think you’re right. As wrong as that is. Nothing makes my skin crawl like profiting off a genocide
You have to wonder if these folks have their own thoughts about it. Or if their thoughts are entirely about what our thoughts are, and how our thoughts about them will be affected by their thoughts about what our thoughts are.
If your talking about politicians then they certainly do. But their actions on something are generally colored by more than their own thoughts. Every successful politician masters the art of not giving answers that can only hurt them. One of the ways you can tell something has shifted is when they suddenly become very specific. Like when Biden was trying to drum up support after his debate. We suddenly got some really specific policy proposals.
Oh, I think we know what those thoughts are going to be.
I don’t care to go back and find all the transcripts but the way she’s talked about it does make me think she’s better than Biden. I don’t think she’s going to abandon Israel as an ally or anything but I do think she’ll force the proper distribution of aid and put a stop to settlers in the West Bank and Gaza. Biden is on track to watch as the Israelis run over all of Palestine in the next few years.
Is Trump getting the same questions?
Does it matter? His answer would be a ten minute stream of consciousness rant about immigrants, Dr. Hannibal Lecter, and some “very smart people” anyway.
while kamala is getting hit on this issue, it’s important for people to keep in mind (or learn if they didn’t know) that Trump has historically been a fanatic supporter of israel and netanyahu. way beyond any other president, D or R.
the moving of the embassy was pretty much a greenlight for them to openly do genocide.
That’s generally true, and if I’m going to be stuck with an American government excusing Israels war crimes, it might as well be one that protects abortion, but there is a big stupid “but” to go with that. Trump hates bibi. Not because of any considered foreign policy thing, but because Trump is mad bibi called biden to congratulate him on winning the election. Trump never has forgiven bibi for this, and has been criticizing bibi on the trail because of it. Our politics are fucked, I guess is what I’m trying to say.
The biggest military aid happened during obama.
that’s not true. see the very first charts here and here.
also, Trump didn’t HAVE to send much aid to israel because 2017-2020 just happened to be a relatively peaceful time with israel/palestine, unlike Obama’s and Biden’s terms.
Trump:
- moved the American embassy to Jerusalem
- has never once uttered the words “cease fire”, only called for Israel’s “victory”
- as far as experts are aware, Trump has never expressed any concern over humanitarian aid in Gaza
- reversed US’s position on Israeli settlements in Palestine, which Biden has again reversed to the original position in accordance with international law
This is exactly what i said trump is honest and vocal about his support to israel. Biden and harris talk about ceasefire but always blame hamas for not happening despite proof that israel is the one refusing and refuse to stop arming israel fully to create pressure. Trump moved the embassy to jerusalem but biden didn’t reverse it and harris won’t do it either
It ABSOLUTELY matters that Trump is put on the same playing field and under the same scrutiny as Harris!!!
That’s all. It doesn’t matter what their respective positions are. It doesn’t matter that Trump will give a rambling, incoherent answer and support Israel even if they declare babies as food.
It matters that Trump is held to the same scrutiny as Harris, simple as that.
No point in asking him. He will call them sexy and claim Martians are taking yellow jobs.
Do you want a 2k words essay without actually answering the question?
Would you seriously want to hear the drivel answers?
Is Trump the sitting vice president of a country facilitating a genocide?
Somewhat bad faith, VP has almost no real power or influence on these masters. With both as potential POTUS’, they should both be held to the same standard by the press.
Let’s hold ourselves to the same standards As Trump!
Do you people not know what a race to the bottom is? Because you’re in one.
their point was, let’s hold trump to the same standards as everyone else.
We do.
It’s his supporters that don’t and they aren’t here on Lemmy so who do you think they’re talking to there?
Do we? Because I haven’t heard Trump being asked this question.
Trump couldn’t answer a question about his favorite flavor of milkshake.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/donald-trump-moans-hes-never-22877706
Good luck getting anything out of him about this.
But then isn’t not asking him because you know you won’t get a straight answer holding him to a different standard? Because that’s the whole issue here.
I’m mostly just joining the pile-on that Trump is an idiot.
It would be great if he were held to any kind of standards, but the time for that was 8-10 years ago. I’m not sure how we get there now.
lemmy is not the point. clearly the top comment was asking if trump was getting asked these same questions in general, not comments on lemmy.
Call me insensitive, but shouldn’t we be more worried about the terrorists on our home soil before fighting foreign lands. As in, every idiot who thought Jan 6 was a good idea. Because I can already picture the unhappy voters reaction whether Dems or MAGA wins.
2 have been fired at Trump, and they’re investigating for Kamala.
And the worst part is: I STILL don’t know who the bad guy is. Israel? Palestine? How should I know, I can barely process the legislation and corruption that was alllowed to pass on our home soil.
Anyway I hope to become more informed on this issue now, seeing as our leader HAS to know a solution. Even though one candidate shouldn’t even be able to walk freely. And I hope everyone else does as well
We can do both
Israel, Israel is the bad guy… Any country/person/company supporting Israel is the bad guy.
So raiding and taking civilians hostage is ok…even good. Holding the hostages for months is ok. Hiding them throughout your population is good. Exposing that population to attack and risk is good.
Israel is 100% wrong in the West Bank but responsibility in Gaza is a moot point.
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You’re misunderstanding the situation.
We’re not asking Kamala to get involved in a foreign war. We’re asking Kamala to end the US’s involvement in a foreign war.
I know it’s confusing, because Biden and Harris keep talking as if they’re doing all they can to stop the fighting. But the truth is, Biden and Harris are the ones providing the weapons.
but shouldn’t we be more worried about the terrorists on our home soil before fighting foreign lands
Probably, which is why Harris should stop giving weapons and billions of dollars of war funding to Israel.
And the worst part is: I STILL don’t know who the bad guy is. Israel? Palestine?
Again, I understand your confusion, because Biden and Harris keep talking about the need to protect Israel. But Israel is the one carrying out a genocide of innocent civilians (with US support).
I’m still wondering when Americans will finally wake up and realise how absolutely fucked their entire system is. You are being forced to pick between a genocidal bastard or fascist wannabe-dictator for the highest seat of government.
You guys really need to get together and just dismantle the entire thing. It was a good try but it’s fucked. Start again.
…we do understand. But solving it isn’t exactly easy. Why don’t we just dismantle a world superpower with the biggest military in the world and a massive landmass and a spread out populace? Oh, why didn’t we think of that.
If people actually accepted the reality of the situation, truly, in their hearts, they wouldn’t find all of these excuses for it. Look at the replies, literally the first one is just “well, trump is worse, so we have to support Kamala”. You, as an individual, understand it when you think logically, but as a collective, the American people aren’t ready to admit that their elections are completely rigged.
Hold up - you don’t have a solution, but you’ll criticise people for doing what they can to keep the fascists out of power?
I agree with what you’re saying broadly, but if you’re going to wax ideological while you let the fascists win, you can fuck all the way off.
I haven’t really criticised anyone for voting for Harris, I absolutely agree that given the situation that you’re in, it’s the right thing to do, no doubt.
My point is that there are so many people who don’t accept that Kamala Harris is a fucking terrible person and in a real democracy she wouldn’t have a chance of getting elected.
You’re in this horrible position where in order to do the right thing you’re forced into supporting a genocide. You have to accept that is what you’re doing, do it anyways, and then do everything you can to bring the system down to stop it from ever happening again.
you’re completely ignoring that a large portion of our populace are racist rednecks who fanatically support a guy like trump. it’s not just a systemic issue, we are a highly polarized nation and overthrowing the government won’t change that, it’ll only make it worse.
“Trump is worse” sounds like a false dichotomy, but it isn’t. First past the post voting mathematically forces a two party system given enough election cycles.
This video shows how: https://youtu.be/s7tWHJfhiyo
So until Americans can have a vote that’s a list instead of a checkmark, the choices really are genocide and super genocide. It’s horrific and so much of it stems from something so innocent.
Gotta tell you, that wannabe dictator would be even more genocidal. The dude was so fanatically pro-Israel in the debate that he accused Harris of being the cause of its destruction within two years if she is elected. He has not called for any sort of cease-fire. He has not criticized arms shipments to Israel and never called for them to be paused.
Stop shifting the blame, currently trump is not in power. So the people in power has all the blame they should get right now. Trump is just more honest but in reality both will do their best to defend israel
Harris is not in power either. She does not set or implement policy. You do know what the powers of the Vice President are, yes?
Are you telling me thst a vice president which one of it’s function is to be advisor to the president shouldn’t have part of the responsability?
Not unless you know what she’s advised him of, no. Or are you under the impression that he has to do what people who advise him say?
If the government support a genocidal terrorist state then anybody in the government has the responsibility to resign
Okay, well that’s not going to happen. So the choice is going to be Trump or Harris and to suggest that we can’t know where Trump stands on Israel compared to Harris is either dishonest or highly ignorant.
The fact is that both of them are on the wrong side of this genocide, so they have to be chosen by other criteria. “Just don’t vote for either of them” is not an answer. That’s also not going to happen for most voters.
That’s not one of the functions of the vice president actually.
blame is irrelevant. what is relevant is choosing who you think will handle it best (or less bad) in the next 4 years. if you think that’s trump, you’re delusional. if you think trump would have handled the last 11 months better, you’re delusional.
Trump is just more honest
…seriously?
Right, but you must realise if I asked you to choose between getting your hand amputated or your arm amputated, for no reason, the correct answer isn’t your hand, it’s to refuse to allow unnecessary amputations to continue.
And how would you propose we do such a thing? Because if “just overthrow the government” was that easy, Donald Trump would be president right now.
Step one is admitting there’s a problem.
Lots of people admit there’s a problem. That doesn’t answer my question.
If you don’t admit that there’s a problem, then answering your question would be a waste of time, because you would, most likely, just be looking for something to argue with me about, rather than considering my points in good faith.
If you’re happy to start the conversation from a place where you admit that, yes, the US political system is so rigged that it is impossible to meaningfully reform, then I’m happy to answer your question.
Sure, there’s a problem. Now please answer my question.
“no reason”? if the alternative to a hand or arm amputation is death, yeah, i’m gonna choose a hand amputation.
that’s what our alternative is in your analogy. remember the US is highly polarized right now, so one (sane) group taking over the US govt is likely impossible, and even if successful would end up in a massive civil war. that would not only destroy life in the US for the foreseeable future, but the entire global economy and geopolitical equilibrium.
There are certainly criticisms to be made but “dismantling the entire thing” is not the way.
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https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/09/kamala-harris-israel-gaza-questions/
Words cannot express what a disappointment Kamala has turned out to be.
Another cut from the same genocidal cloth.
I disappointment suggests you had hope in the first place. I doubt that
I did actually, I thought she might be better than Biden. I even stopped speaking critically of her for the other shit I’m not a fan of (ex. her law enforcement career).
I can bite my tongue for somethings, but not when it comes to genocide. There’s no middle ground to be met on.
Well I’m blissfully unaware of the stranglehold that the Jewish lobby has in American politics. But it seems that there no chance of getting elected when pissing them off.
I’m in favor of actions instead of words. Trump showed us he’s deep on Bibi’s cock. I hope that securing the election victory maar remove that stranglehold.
Let us not confuse Zionisim with the Jewish religion, please.
Let’s not dismiss the horrors of abrahamic faiths either
I can do one without doing the other. I am an atheist and do not care for religion at all. However, that does not mean I blame Jews for something another group, the Zionists, think and do. Sure there is an overlap and corrolation, but the same is also very much true for the US Christian nut jobs along with others.
If you are going to label people and reject them on the basis of their label, make sure to label them right.
I agree, though it’s hard to define s clear dividing line.
Zoom out, look at the bigger picture beyond your single issue
The single issue is called genocide.
It is not negotiable.
Everyone says that about their single issue.
I agree it’s important but other things also exist.
Oh yeah “shut up about your single issue where people are dying because I don’t like their tax proposal”. Fuck anyone who openly supports genocide like this.
Acknowledging other political issues exist and are at play in this election != supporting genocide and the comparison is fucking stupid.
“in this election” dude this election has been happening since 67’ and even before that. The cognitive disonance simply makes you revert to tribal politics and “my side being the only choice uga buga”. You are supporting genocide by voting for a candidate that will support genocide and won’t do anything about it, or worse will put their hand to it by exporting even more weapons to Israel. That’s their policy - that nothing will change. They will “call for a two state solution” when people in Gaza are being displaced, killed in the thousands, their houses and hospitals being bombed regularly.
This is exactly your doing. You don’t get a pass because “the other tribe is worse uga buga”
I don’t think Harris has a good stance on Gaza. You’re berating the wrong person.
I do think Harris has the best chance to improve the life of myself and my family.
Both of these ideas can exist. Confusing, I know.
Like you realize your particular style of rhetoric here doesn’t help anyone and just makes you look like a prick, right?
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