Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy and other European leaders have applauded the US for passing a vital €89 billion aid bill which has been struggling to make it through the House of Representatives for months.
The House swiftly approved roughly €89 billion in foreign aid for Ukraine, Israel and other US allies in a rare Saturday session as Democrats and Republicans banded together after months of hard-right resistance over renewed American support for repelling Russia’s invasion.
With an overwhelming vote, €57 billion in aid for Ukraine passed in a matter of minutes, a strong showing as American lawmakers race to deliver a fresh round of US support to the war-torn ally. Many Democrats cheered on the House floor and waved blue-and-yellow flags of Ukraine.
What a wonderful time we live in, expressing an opinion that murdering people is not OK is now considered fascist :)
Again, you did not even specify what propaganda do I believe? Seriously, why is everybody here so incapable of having a discussion?
Ok I’ll bite and play a guessing game with you.
Do you consider that “Zelenskyy is the one not negotiating while Russia has repeatedly said it is willing to negotiate” a propaganda?
If so, just let me know and I will give you sources for that, I just though that it is widely known?
The point is that it’s a shit argument because you don’t negociate with terrorists. If I come into your house and claim the kitchen as my own because it used to be mine 50 years ago, will you say “ok, fine, keep it, but promise me you won’t take the bathroom or the living room later”?
Do you really not see the irony? Not even the smallest bit? Holy shit…
You can’t claim my kitchen because it was your 50 years ago, but Ukraine can claim Crimea because it used to be theirs 10 years ago?
So the period where you can claim something as your because it belonged to you some time ago is greater than 10 years but smaller than 50 years, is that right?
Okay I actually know the answer to that question - it’s “whatever USA says it is” (rephrased to something like international agreements or UN stuff), sure.
Anyway, this is offtopic. Calling each other terrorists (yeah Russia does that as well) is as counter-productive as it gets, but let’s discuss it anyway.
Definition (from wikipedia, not mine!):
Terrorism, in its broadest sense, is the use of intentional violence and fear to achieve political or ideological aims. The term is used in this regard primarily to refer to intentional violence during peacetime or in the context of war against non-combatants. There are various different definitions of terrorism, with no universal agreement about it.Regime of zelensky uses violence (in the form of kidnapping people on the streets and sending them to the meat grinder) and fear (people fear to go outside because they can be kidnapped at any time, fear for themselves and for their family) to achieve political aims of conquering territories (you can read it as “reclaiming”, does not matter).
So isn’t it the west that shouldn’t be negotiating with zelensky and instead sending military aid to Russia to deal with terrorists as soon as possible?
See? This is why nobody talks to you. Because you think Russia “own” Crimea because they took it 10 years ago. Because you think Russia owns abkazia and south Ossetia because they took it in 2008. Chechnya in 2000 and Transnistria in 92.
You don’t wanna admit it, because as I’ve said, you’re either getting paid or you’re too dumb to see it, but the common denominator is Russia here. They’re the aggressors.
And let’s not pretend that all the Russians that have suddenly showed up in western countries aren’t running away from getting drafted. All the poor ones that couldn’t are doing what? Living happily in Russia or are sent to the front? Ofc you’ll say they’re all happily serving. Except for all the ones that have surrendered and claimed they weren’t even told they were going to war. But that’s all Ukrainian propaganda, right?
Everything Russia does is fine and normal and everything Ukraine does is kidnap, kill, corruption, etc. Right? Makes perfect sense… When you’re being paid by one side… Shrug I’m done… Hope you get whatever it is you deserve :) bb!
Thank you for proving my point! Yes, you are right, they are running away from getting draft.
Because they can! They have a choice! Ukrainians don’t. Ukrainians are trapped in Ukraine and slowly getting butchered thanks to the support from your government.
Ahahahha… running away from draft = they had a choice. No, if they had been given a choice they would’ve stayed home. Unlike all the Ukrainians that were forced to flee from the invaders. Because there’s plenty of those as well. But I’m sure you’ll have something to say about that as well… russians in Europe= they have a choice. Ukrainians in Europe = what? Please tell me, I’m sure it’s not “because they can! They have a choice!” Is it?
Also nice dodging of everything else I’ve said. It’s great to see your conversation skills. You’re almost as good as a 3 year old…" Noooo, why won’t you people have a discussion?! Why?! Is it because I’m a vatnik?! What?! Noooo, I’m not, I’m trying to have a discussion but I only bring up lies and twisted bullshit that I’ve been paid to say and ignore everything else, noooo… "
Anyway, let’s keep going, let’s get you some more rubles. Or is it monero for you? xD Tell me more.
They have SOME choice. Ukrainians have none.
They CANNOT (at least legally) flee from the invaders. They are locked in a west-sponsored prison called “Ukraine”.
Russians in Europe = they bought a ticket, boarded a plane and landed in Europe. As simple as that.
Ukrainians in Europe = they either
So - yes exactly, just like I said, people on the territories controlled by Russia have a choice, on territories controlled by Ukraine - they are imprisoned.
That is quite funny, because I’m constantly being accused of that, yet nobody even pointed out what exactly I lie about let alone disproving those lies… Weird, don’t you think?..
What exactly would you like me to respond to? It’s mostly Ad Hominem about me being stupid, or the usual western “you have different opinion than me so you must be a Russian bot / paid by Russia”, I don’t think it makes sense to respond to that.
I’ve never said that, if that’s what you want me to respond to.
Let me bring it up again then, because if you didn’t ignore it before then you must’ve simply not noticed it. Russia took Crimea and that was fine because it was theirs to begin with or whatever right? Georgia Ossetia and Abkhazia ? Chechnya? Transnistria? All of these democratically elected to be “independent” or to be russian right? Definitely nothing going on there.
And well, I personally know plenty of Ukrainians that aren’t hiding and they haven’t been drafted yet. So I don’t see why they’d need to resort to kidnappings to get people on the frontlines.Go on twitch and other streaming services and you can talk to them yourself. And not talking about the popular ones, there’s people with 0-3 viewers, so you can’t claim they’re public figures and they’re exceptions or whatever .
I am not saying either of those things are okay or not okay (as well as other countries annexing other countries’ territories btw), because it depends on whether the people there wanted to part of Russia or not (and we cannot know this for sure, as different sides will claim differently).
As for the Crimea in particular though, I was there a few times while it still belonged to Ukraine, and the people I’ve met there were mostly extremely pro-Russian and some were openly saying they would like to be a part of Russia. But of course this is a hearsay, and you may have heard different things (which wouldn’t mean that either one of us is wrong!), but as I said before I do not assert that this is okay or not okay, I am only saying that I find it quite possible that in case of Crimea it was indeed will of the people (which would make it okay).
The same applies to Donbas - while I have never been there, I’ve met people from there and some of them were pro-Ukrainian some of them were pro-Russian, I met more pro-Russian ones (but again, I agree that this is a hearsay).
As for the other annexed Ukrainian territories and the countries/regions you’ve mentioned - I have never spoken with people from those territories, so again I do not assert it was fine or not fine, as it depends on what people of those territories think - and I do now know that.
Everybody I know who hasn’t managed to escape and is of the draft age and isn’t a college student is trying to hide.
And yet they do.
https://uadraftmuseum.ch
Because Zelensky’s propaganda repeated by western media is saying that everybody wants to fight Russia and everybody volunteers, while the reality is completely different, and who could have thought - people want to live instead of dying for their politicians (which is what Zelensky with support from the west is doing). And speaking out this fact, that people want to live, and that it is not okay to kill them, makes people call me fascist here. To clarify - I am not saying there are no volunteers, I even have some distant relatives who have volunteered, but they are a minority, the regime needs to kidnap people from the streets in order to survive.
I have no need for that, it’s only logical that not everybody has been kidnapped yet, they do it when they need more people for the meat grinder.
And as I said - for now not everybody needs to fear being kidnapped at any time, as they are not touching some groups of people currently. But they already lowered the age of acceptable kidnapping from 27 to 25, and some even say that kidnapping 18 year olds is only a matter of time (I’ve read stories about how they have already kidnapped a few kids, and even girls, it’s just that for now they let them go when they discover their age/gender, but for how long? let me know if you want me to try to find those stories :) ). Some say that women should get the same treatment.