“Every previous president would have ended it by now.”

“Biden literally couldn’t do worse.”

  • Minotaur@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    18
    arrow-down
    42
    ·
    8 months ago

    Yeah I dunno, I’m still not going to vote for him. Just goes against my conscious

    • originalfrozenbanana@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      42
      arrow-down
      12
      ·
      8 months ago

      Cool I’ll tell that to my trans friends when Trump tried to pass Floridas laws federally

      At least your “conscious” is clear

        • originalfrozenbanana@lemm.ee
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          24
          arrow-down
          9
          ·
          8 months ago

          Nah we can take it up with you, because the choice is Biden or Trump, not Biden, Trump, or time travel. Pull your head out of your ass - your little protest vote doesn’t matter now, but your ACTUAL vote does.

          • Minotaur@lemm.ee
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            13
            arrow-down
            16
            ·
            8 months ago

            Go ahead. Take it up with me then. Hope it helps. I doubt it will.

                • originalfrozenbanana@lemm.ee
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  9
                  arrow-down
                  3
                  ·
                  edit-2
                  8 months ago

                  Is your protest vote saving Palestinians? At least my vote conceivably could have an impact

                  With one term, Trump stacked the federal judiciary for a generation and eroded the administrative state. If he gets another terms he’ll use his stacked bench to pass his agenda and uphold it when it’s inevitably challenged. How do you think progressive causes will fare then? At least you’ll have your protest vote to soothe your conscience as Trump enacts a little genocide on immigrants, trans people, and anyone else he decides isn’t pure enough.

                  In 2016 people like you were smugly announcing that nothing bad would happen, like Roe being repealed, and everyone was being dramatic, because Clinton was “just as bad” as Trump. So fascinated to hear what your excuses will be this time around.

                  • Minotaur@lemm.ee
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    6
                    arrow-down
                    11
                    ·
                    8 months ago

                    I can’t bring myself to vote for someone like Joe Biden. Without getting too in depth on my life story, I’ve been falsely arrested before. Hell, I’ve basically paid the price for a crime I didn’t commit. So when someone like Joe Biden promises police reform and then turns around and immediately pours $34 billion dollars into 100,000 more cops and more surveillance, I just genuinely cannot bring myself to vote for him any more than you could bring yourself to vote for your abuser.

                    At the same time, I have great sympathy for Palestinians. Here in the US and abroad. And I also cannot expect them to vote for someone assisting in the genocide of their friends and family, even if some political arithmetic says they should.

                    I don’t bemoan you for voting for Joe Biden. But I’m voting third party this time around. Maybe it’ll send a message to the DNC, maybe it won’t. It’s the only voice I got as a singular voter to cast my vote in a democratic process towards what I believe in the most.

      • Shake747@lemmy.dbzer0.com
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        13
        arrow-down
        42
        ·
        8 months ago

        Cool, when you and your friends band together and vote for someone who’s not apart of the war machine, then you can ride your high horses

          • Shake747@lemmy.dbzer0.com
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            9
            arrow-down
            20
            ·
            8 months ago

            Your solution to losing is to now bandwagon with “the lesser of two evils”? Why wouldn’t you abandon that party entirely? There’s more than two choices.

            They’ll kill and take away the rights of people who aren’t you though…yay…

            To top it off, you go on to bash those who think that’s not a good choice

            The irony.

            But don’t listen to me, I’m the stupid one.

            • originalfrozenbanana@lemm.ee
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              14
              arrow-down
              8
              ·
              8 months ago

              At least you recognize it.

              There’s two choices. Protests votes in the general election in the system we have today are at best no votes, but are often just votes for the other candidate. Your moral high ground is nothing and smugly voting third party doesn’t actually DO anything right now.

              • Shake747@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                8
                arrow-down
                8
                ·
                8 months ago

                How else would you go about removing the two parties from power?

                I don’t think continuing to support the party with a vote is really the answer here.

                • lennybird@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  10
                  arrow-down
                  3
                  ·
                  8 months ago

                  Easy. By eliminating the worse party and transforming the existing one. Parties have already vanished in our system in the past; see the Whigs.If you’re older than 22-years-old you recognize just how much progress Dems have made in the past 15 or so years. So continue promoting progressive candidates in Dems while ensuring GOP go the way of the Whigs. Start advocating for campaign finance / election reform as your primary voting concern and that you’ll donate to anyone who pushes this.

                  Things take time but a protest vote inevitably leads to the worst evil prevailing.

                • JustAnotherRando@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  8
                  arrow-down
                  4
                  ·
                  8 months ago

                  If you think that “protest votes” have any chance of removing the two parties from power, you’re naive. If it were that easy, it would have already happened as people have been voting and advocating for third party votes for generations. The way to actually affect change is to engage vociferously in primaries and lower level offices to get outside voices in at a level to actually change things - specifically abandoning FPTP voting and getting third party candidates in local offices (and eventually ditch the electoral college). Even if you somehow magically convinced everyone that “would like to vote for someone other than D’s and R’s” to actually do so in a national election, having a candidate that adequately represented enough people’s beliefs to win is a statistical impossibility.
                  The fascists/Christian Nationalists have been methodically working towards their goals for decades; to think that you have any chance of overthrowing the Democratic or Republican party in this election is beyond laughable.

            • webadict@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              4
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              8 months ago

              There’s more than two choices the same way there’s more than two choices for calling a coin. You can call a side. You can call for the edges. You can call that it balances diagonally. You can even call for a unicorn to magically appear over one of the sides. The chances are so slim that you might as well have chosen no side at all, but it could happen, and it is a choice.

              Personally, anyone that says there are more than two parties has no idea how statistics and/or voting works, or they don’t really care about the outcome.

    • Leate_Wonceslace@lemmy.dbzer0.comOP
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      15
      arrow-down
      7
      ·
      8 months ago

      Your conscience can be a good indicator that something immoral is happening, but it’s certainly not infallible. While I think abstaining is a worse choice, the most egregious course of action being discussed is actively arguing against voting, which is actively harmful and supports multiple genocides including the one ostensibly being denounced by the people who act as such.

      • Minotaur@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        12
        arrow-down
        24
        ·
        8 months ago

        I think everyone should vote. I’m just voting third party in this case

        • MrSpArkle@lemmy.ca
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          8
          arrow-down
          2
          ·
          edit-2
          8 months ago

          I voted third party too once. I couldn’t in good conscience vote for either major party. I was living in Florida, and voted for Nader in 2000.

          I’ve not been so naive since.

          Did I not vote for the killing of children in Iraq and Afghanistan? Did I not vote for the curtailing of medical research? Did I not vote for the hundreds of millions that will die due to climate change?

          Learn from my mistake. Because the lessons you learn from yours may not be applicable given what will be lost by the time you realize what you’ve done.

          • Minotaur@lemm.ee
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            6
            arrow-down
            3
            ·
            8 months ago

            I hear you. And I appreciate your candor and politeness, which can be hard to ask for sometimes.

            I’m still planning on voting third party. I’ve voted dem every time since I could vote, I feel like I gotta draw a line in the sand somewhere. But! By golly, if he says he’s going to cut some of the money out of the police, and maybe tighten some things up in the Middle East, he’ll have me again. And he’s got months to do that! And I’m hoping. But if that effort isn’t made and he focuses on the center-right… I just can’t do it.

            • bobburger@fedia.io
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              8
              arrow-down
              2
              ·
              8 months ago

              The far right gets a lot of attention politically because they show up and vote Republican consistently.

              Progressives are generally ignored because they always have some reason their conscience won’t allow them to vote Democratic.

              If you aren’t a reliable voting block you can’t expect your platform to be given priority.

            • Pan_Ziemniak@midwest.social
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              2
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              8 months ago

              You want very reasonable things in a unreasonable system.

              Youll either get the status quo as it stands, or you’ll get Dr. Fascismo doing away with free elections on top of an Eastern European genocide courtesy of trumps master, minorities being actively persecuted for just existing, and saying the things youre saying being documented and held against you as thoughtcrimes.

              The US is on the cusp of moving past the stain that is rhe baby boomer voting block that insists on unfettered neoliberalism and conservative social policy by and large. Thisd be the time to ensure we dont double down on it.