Checking a revolver to confirm they type of prop ammo is very different than a regular weapon check.
Different shots require different ammo. You may have a shot where the revolver is seen from the business end, so there needs to be a bullet of some kind in the cartridge - so maybe it’s a real bullet with no powder or primer. Or maybe the shot shows an open cylinder, so you need primers but no bullets. Or maybe you need to show the actor loading, so it’s a plastic primer or entirely fake round. Or maybe it’s being fired, so you need a blank…
The mixture of different kinds of prop ammo is how Brandon Lee was killed on set. A bullet came dislodged from a round being used for a previous scene and was still in the barrel when a blank was fired. That effectively made a live round that killed Lee.
So the barrel also needs to be checked for squibs if it’s goong to be loaded with blanks.
It’s not as simple as a regular press-check or opening the cylinder. I carry a gun every day and am a firm believer in gun safety at all times, but props are treated differently because they are different.
As a part of their job, actors will point guns at each other and pull the triggers. The normal firearm safety procedures just don’t work with them.
Checking a revolver to confirm they type of prop ammo is very different than a regular weapon check.
And YOU should learn how to check the gun in YOUR hand, regardless of if it is a Colt SAA or a Jimenez.
Some of that should be handled by the armorer, as in Brandon Lee’s case the armorer pulled the bullet and powder, but reseated the bullet onto the fresh primer. He should have popped the primer and punched it back to normal with a pin punch, then reseat and engrave on the casing “inert” with a dremel. That was 100% his fault.
This one could have been solved simply by basic gun safety that I’d expect from friends who aren’t in the industry as well, that is why I blame both Baldwin and the armorer.
Frankly, all actors who use real guns in movies should be required by SAG to take a basic safety course. They don’t have to go full Keanu, just go to the nearest range and ask any RSO if they’d like a SAG job, teaching people with the brain of a fifth grader some gun safety (had to get in a dig on them lol), should be good enough. Then the armorer should spend an hour familiarizing you with your gun on set before live rounds are even brought on set. Guns are dangerous and we shouldn’t just throw gun safety out the window because some rich guy with a bullshit job thinks it is below him to learn it, they actually need to learn it better than most with the nature of their job sometimes requiring them to break a rule (like sometimes they have to point them at people, which, while that is a no-no it can be done more safely than it currently is, and that frankly shouldn’t be controversial.)
Actors’ job isn’t to be as knowledgeable as a firearm consultant, hence why they hire one. The same way they trust any scene has been safely planned out before hand and the giant boulder is assumed to be fake and not a real rock, and the harnesses that suspend them weren’t set up wrong so they fall and break their neck.
I’m not a gun guy and think this is a weird take that leans into the weird fantasy the NRA pushes of every person (who touches a real gun) becoming a gun aficionado knowledgable about basic safety procedure regarding the tool in their hand that has the ability to take another’s life whether you meant to or not.
Ftfy.
You don’t want to learn how to use guns safely? Don’t use a gun. You don’t want to learn how to use a chainsaw safely? Don’t use a chainsaw. It really isn’t as hard as you guys make it seem, either memorize this 8min video or you don’t get no guns. It is the absolute most basic prerequisite for handling a firearm.
Range safety is a class that takes less than an hour to teach, and Alec Baldwin had to go through one of these classes for the movie. You don’t need to be a gun nut to understand how to check a firearm and be safe.
Also, don’t lump me in with the NRA. They’re a racist, psychotic organization
I don’t think any knowledge can be permanently retained from a one-hour class. There are things I’ve learned for my job weeks ago that directly correlate to my field of expertise, that I still constantly need to look up from time to time.
Not to mention, I doubt a one hour course could cover the mechanisms of every uniquely-operated firearm in existence.
I don’t think any knowledge can be permanently retained from a one-hour class.
I learned how to build AR-15s in an hour and retained it, they can learn how to do this and this in an hour and if they can’t they can’t handle real guns until they can.
Not to mention, I doubt a one hour course could cover the mechanisms of every uniquely-operated firearm in existence.
While most will be the same as their class of weaponry (i.e semi autos mostly all function the same, revolvers mostly all function the same, and single action revolvers mostly all function the same), you really just need to sit them down for a few minutes before the shoot and get them familiarized with the gun they’ll be using. For instance, an actor in a cowboy movie should be sat down before filming and learn how to safely handle the Winchester and Colt he’ll be using for the duration of filming, but we don’t need to teach him how to change barrels on an MG-42 because that won’t be “invented” for another 80yrs. Similarly, a WWII german soldier actor in saving private ryan needs to learn about his “issued” Luger or Walther p38, and his Kar98k, not the cowboy’s SAA and Model 1891. And Tom Hanks needs to learn about his Colt 1911, but not “the enemy” actor’s Luger, so long as he isn’t touching the Luger. They don’t need to be weapons experts, just have absolutely basic knowledge of the thing in their hand that is capable of killing someone whether they “meant to” or not. It is the same thing I expect from pizza drivers, butchers, baristas, etc, I don’t care what you do for a living if you touch guns you should know basic safety procedures involving them, why should he get a pass because he’s an actor, when I wouldn’t give a pass to the equally unrelated-to-firearms job of accounting?
Especially aiming directly at her and pulling the trigger. I don’t believe it was malicious but damn; I would never consider that without triple clearing the weapon. I still would feel comfortable.
Yes. Any layman with 15min of instruction (with THAT firearm, not even another of the same kind, THAT ONE) should be able to unload and show clear, OR they don’t get greenlit to hold a real gun, nonfiring replicas only.
We’re only giving him a pass because he’s an “actor,” I used to be a pizza driver and showed my boss my carry one night, before I passed it to him I gave him a basic run down on how to make sure it was safe, handed it to him and he reproduced it instantly. You’re telling me, that I can expect a Jordanian man who has never held a gun, who is just an owner-operator of a local pizza spot, to check if the gun is safe, but not Alec Baldwin who was Jack Ryan in The Hunt for Red October (had gun), a cop in The Departed (had gun), 30 Rock (one episode he had gun), was in Miami Blues (with a gun), The Getaway (with a gun), The Juror (had a gun), The Edge (gun), Pixie (guns), and he can’t be bothered to learn how to use them safely? Fuck that.
Even if he took the bullet out he would have seen it was indeed a blank. He would have had to take the bullet out and hold the barrel up to the light with the chamber open to see a previous bullet was stuck in the barrel.
As a “gun guy”, I think Alec Baldwin the actor is also to blame for not learning/practicing firearm safety. Always check your weapon.
Checking a revolver to confirm they type of prop ammo is very different than a regular weapon check.
Different shots require different ammo. You may have a shot where the revolver is seen from the business end, so there needs to be a bullet of some kind in the cartridge - so maybe it’s a real bullet with no powder or primer. Or maybe the shot shows an open cylinder, so you need primers but no bullets. Or maybe you need to show the actor loading, so it’s a plastic primer or entirely fake round. Or maybe it’s being fired, so you need a blank…
The mixture of different kinds of prop ammo is how Brandon Lee was killed on set. A bullet came dislodged from a round being used for a previous scene and was still in the barrel when a blank was fired. That effectively made a live round that killed Lee.
So the barrel also needs to be checked for squibs if it’s goong to be loaded with blanks.
It’s not as simple as a regular press-check or opening the cylinder. I carry a gun every day and am a firm believer in gun safety at all times, but props are treated differently because they are different.
As a part of their job, actors will point guns at each other and pull the triggers. The normal firearm safety procedures just don’t work with them.
And YOU should learn how to check the gun in YOUR hand, regardless of if it is a Colt SAA or a Jimenez.
Some of that should be handled by the armorer, as in Brandon Lee’s case the armorer pulled the bullet and powder, but reseated the bullet onto the fresh primer. He should have popped the primer and punched it back to normal with a pin punch, then reseat and engrave on the casing “inert” with a dremel. That was 100% his fault.
This one could have been solved simply by basic gun safety that I’d expect from friends who aren’t in the industry as well, that is why I blame both Baldwin and the armorer.
Frankly, all actors who use real guns in movies should be required by SAG to take a basic safety course. They don’t have to go full Keanu, just go to the nearest range and ask any RSO if they’d like a SAG job, teaching people with the brain of a fifth grader some gun safety (had to get in a dig on them lol), should be good enough. Then the armorer should spend an hour familiarizing you with your gun on set before live rounds are even brought on set. Guns are dangerous and we shouldn’t just throw gun safety out the window because some rich guy with a bullshit job thinks it is below him to learn it, they actually need to learn it better than most with the nature of their job sometimes requiring them to break a rule (like sometimes they have to point them at people, which, while that is a no-no it can be done more safely than it currently is, and that frankly shouldn’t be controversial.)
Those business end shots, the powder is replaced with BB’s so yes it is easy to figure out if it is real or not.
The actors should know what is in the firearm before it is handed to them and verify after. Otherwise they shouldn’t be handling said firearm.
Safety is EVERYONES responsibility.
Actors’ job isn’t to be as knowledgeable as a firearm consultant, hence why they hire one. The same way they trust any scene has been safely planned out before hand and the giant boulder is assumed to be fake and not a real rock, and the harnesses that suspend them weren’t set up wrong so they fall and break their neck.
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Ftfy.
You don’t want to learn how to use guns safely? Don’t use a gun. You don’t want to learn how to use a chainsaw safely? Don’t use a chainsaw. It really isn’t as hard as you guys make it seem, either memorize this 8min video or you don’t get no guns. It is the absolute most basic prerequisite for handling a firearm.
Range safety is a class that takes less than an hour to teach, and Alec Baldwin had to go through one of these classes for the movie. You don’t need to be a gun nut to understand how to check a firearm and be safe.
Also, don’t lump me in with the NRA. They’re a racist, psychotic organization
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I don’t think any knowledge can be permanently retained from a one-hour class. There are things I’ve learned for my job weeks ago that directly correlate to my field of expertise, that I still constantly need to look up from time to time.
Not to mention, I doubt a one hour course could cover the mechanisms of every uniquely-operated firearm in existence.
That first paragraph sounds like software engineering lol
I learned how to build AR-15s in an hour and retained it, they can learn how to do this and this in an hour and if they can’t they can’t handle real guns until they can.
While most will be the same as their class of weaponry (i.e semi autos mostly all function the same, revolvers mostly all function the same, and single action revolvers mostly all function the same), you really just need to sit them down for a few minutes before the shoot and get them familiarized with the gun they’ll be using. For instance, an actor in a cowboy movie should be sat down before filming and learn how to safely handle the Winchester and Colt he’ll be using for the duration of filming, but we don’t need to teach him how to change barrels on an MG-42 because that won’t be “invented” for another 80yrs. Similarly, a WWII german soldier actor in saving private ryan needs to learn about his “issued” Luger or Walther p38, and his Kar98k, not the cowboy’s SAA and Model 1891. And Tom Hanks needs to learn about his Colt 1911, but not “the enemy” actor’s Luger, so long as he isn’t touching the Luger. They don’t need to be weapons experts, just have absolutely basic knowledge of the thing in their hand that is capable of killing someone whether they “meant to” or not. It is the same thing I expect from pizza drivers, butchers, baristas, etc, I don’t care what you do for a living if you touch guns you should know basic safety procedures involving them, why should he get a pass because he’s an actor, when I wouldn’t give a pass to the equally unrelated-to-firearms job of accounting?
But it’s not a weapon, it’s a prop.
Are you saying all children should learn firearm safety to handle their water pistols?
It’s both which seems unreasonable
Can that water pistol fire a live .45lc round?
Especially aiming directly at her and pulling the trigger. I don’t believe it was malicious but damn; I would never consider that without triple clearing the weapon. I still would feel comfortable.
Can a layman even check that? The gun was supposed to be loaded. Just loaded with a blank
Yes. Any layman with 15min of instruction (with THAT firearm, not even another of the same kind, THAT ONE) should be able to unload and show clear, OR they don’t get greenlit to hold a real gun, nonfiring replicas only.
We’re only giving him a pass because he’s an “actor,” I used to be a pizza driver and showed my boss my carry one night, before I passed it to him I gave him a basic run down on how to make sure it was safe, handed it to him and he reproduced it instantly. You’re telling me, that I can expect a Jordanian man who has never held a gun, who is just an owner-operator of a local pizza spot, to check if the gun is safe, but not Alec Baldwin who was Jack Ryan in The Hunt for Red October (had gun), a cop in The Departed (had gun), 30 Rock (one episode he had gun), was in Miami Blues (with a gun), The Getaway (with a gun), The Juror (had a gun), The Edge (gun), Pixie (guns), and he can’t be bothered to learn how to use them safely? Fuck that.
Yes. Blanks don’t have a bullet in the cartridge. It’s just crimped on the end
Even if he took the bullet out he would have seen it was indeed a blank. He would have had to take the bullet out and hold the barrel up to the light with the chamber open to see a previous bullet was stuck in the barrel.
So he needs to take the bullet out, inspect and reload? Is there additional risk making an actor do that? Honestly asking
Not sure how there would be any additional risk as long as the actor keeps their finger off the trigger until they’re ready to shoot