Have you never asked yourself why so many people of this one religion turn out to have “psychological problems”? What are the chances of that statistically if, as you seem to suggest, religion has nothing to do with this?
Next, this person is trying to disassociate their skin color from their opinion, and in response you are insisting on essentializing them on the basis of biology. Have you considered how close this puts you to people you claim to abhor?
Have you never asked yourself why so many people of this one religion turn out to have “psychological problems”? What are the chances of that statistically if, as you seem to suggest, religion has nothing to do with this?
No, because this is horseshit. Muslims in Europe aren’t more violent than non muslims. They are more often subject to violence and discrimination by the white majority though. It is just that violence commited by muslims, or people claimed to be muslim is disproporitonately sensationalized by right wing media. Of course this is accompanied with white supremacists spurting desinformation and claiming every crime, where no information on nationality, skin colour or religion of the suspects is known, as being commited by muslims. Also violence against muslims is systematically underreported, but that would make for another dozens paragraphs.
and in response you are insisting on essentializing them on the basis of biology. Have you considered how close this puts you to people you claim to abhor?
You are wrong. I’m warning him, that this will be done to him, by the people whose agenda he is supporting, by making evidently false claims about the suspect and the treatment of the suspect. He is also blowing the right wing dogwhistle of violent muslims being “imported” to Europe. And the fascists whose position he is strengthening by doing this will not care. Just earlier this week an ex-muslim gay men of turkish origin wanted to join the German Nazi party AfD. He was met with calls to violence and having him deported, that led to him experiencing more racism and hostility in a few days, than in his entire life in Germany before. The fascist dogs will not accept him for blowing their whistle. They’ll tear him apart like everybody else if they get the chance to.
Muslims in Europe aren’t more violent than non muslims
In terms of terrorism, the statistics say otherwise. In terms of general crime, the prison statistics do too. Of course, you will explain all this away as a product of systemic discrimination. But does it not bother you that immigrants of other religions, who also may also have darker skins, do so much better in their adopted homelands?
Also violence against muslims is systematically underreported
This is conspiracism. It’s impossible to argue with, by definition.
It is just that violence commited by muslims, or people claimed to be muslim is disproporitonately sensationalized by right wing media
This common argument is interesting because the implication is that speaker is somehow intellectually superior than the person being addressed. We all have access to the same information, how come only you know how to avoid being indoctrinated? Are you saying I’m dumb? Go on, just come out and say, I won’t be offended.
Because that’s what underlies the argument. As it happens, and as you might guess, I personally am extremely well-informed, and almost entirely from mainstream professional journalists who are affiliated to boring organizations with serious reputations to protect. I am over-educated and I don’t go near sensationalist right-wing media, or social media. And in fact I don’t even vote for right-wing parties. How do you explain that? I think you should try a new tack: taking people’s opinions at face value rather than looking for manipulation, and listening to why people themselves say they think what they do.
Addendum. Downvoting is so much easier than finding a counter-argument, right? I will take it as proof that my points hit their mark. Good night.
Oh what is this? Ethno-nationalist terrorism being by far the most prevalent, by about factor 8-10 compared to jihadist terrorism? I am sure this must be a conspiracist source. Oh what is this? It is the European Council.
This is conspiracism. It’s impossible to argue with, by definition.
I fully agree, that you are trying to spread conspiracies and that it is moot to discuss further with you.
First off, I would just like to point out that I have not downvoted anyone in this thread. I do not censor other people’s opinions, however misguided I personally consider them. Apparently you do like to tape mask over the faces of people you disagree with.
he claims
You are getting lost in the claims and counter-claims. Their claim was that “Muslims are not more violent than non-Muslims”. Your claim is about who is committing terrorism. That is not the same thing.
The terrorist statistics have always skewed towards nationalists - but that is on the widest definition of terrorism. Arsons, letter bombs, and the like. But not the deaths caused by terrorism, which is what most ordinary folk are thinking about. That is Islamists, and has been for years. You should know that already, you seem well-informed. I will not speculate about your motives in ignoring it.
But now I am getting sidetracked too. My argument was about Islam versus other religions. And there, I’m afraid to say that the statistics are clear as day. And again, you both must know this already.
Have you never asked yourself why so many people of this one religion turn out to have “psychological problems”? What are the chances of that statistically if, as you seem to suggest, religion has nothing to do with this?
Next, this person is trying to disassociate their skin color from their opinion, and in response you are insisting on essentializing them on the basis of biology. Have you considered how close this puts you to people you claim to abhor?
No, because this is horseshit. Muslims in Europe aren’t more violent than non muslims. They are more often subject to violence and discrimination by the white majority though. It is just that violence commited by muslims, or people claimed to be muslim is disproporitonately sensationalized by right wing media. Of course this is accompanied with white supremacists spurting desinformation and claiming every crime, where no information on nationality, skin colour or religion of the suspects is known, as being commited by muslims. Also violence against muslims is systematically underreported, but that would make for another dozens paragraphs.
You are wrong. I’m warning him, that this will be done to him, by the people whose agenda he is supporting, by making evidently false claims about the suspect and the treatment of the suspect. He is also blowing the right wing dogwhistle of violent muslims being “imported” to Europe. And the fascists whose position he is strengthening by doing this will not care. Just earlier this week an ex-muslim gay men of turkish origin wanted to join the German Nazi party AfD. He was met with calls to violence and having him deported, that led to him experiencing more racism and hostility in a few days, than in his entire life in Germany before. The fascist dogs will not accept him for blowing their whistle. They’ll tear him apart like everybody else if they get the chance to.
In terms of terrorism, the statistics say otherwise. In terms of general crime, the prison statistics do too. Of course, you will explain all this away as a product of systemic discrimination. But does it not bother you that immigrants of other religions, who also may also have darker skins, do so much better in their adopted homelands?
This is conspiracism. It’s impossible to argue with, by definition.
This common argument is interesting because the implication is that speaker is somehow intellectually superior than the person being addressed. We all have access to the same information, how come only you know how to avoid being indoctrinated? Are you saying I’m dumb? Go on, just come out and say, I won’t be offended.
Because that’s what underlies the argument. As it happens, and as you might guess, I personally am extremely well-informed, and almost entirely from mainstream professional journalists who are affiliated to boring organizations with serious reputations to protect. I am over-educated and I don’t go near sensationalist right-wing media, or social media. And in fact I don’t even vote for right-wing parties. How do you explain that? I think you should try a new tack: taking people’s opinions at face value rather than looking for manipulation, and listening to why people themselves say they think what they do.
Addendum. Downvoting is so much easier than finding a counter-argument, right? I will take it as proof that my points hit their mark. Good night.
he claims, not providing any source. But how about taking a proper look:
https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/infographics/terrorism-eu-facts-figures/
Oh what is this? Ethno-nationalist terrorism being by far the most prevalent, by about factor 8-10 compared to jihadist terrorism? I am sure this must be a conspiracist source. Oh what is this? It is the European Council.
I fully agree, that you are trying to spread conspiracies and that it is moot to discuss further with you.
First off, I would just like to point out that I have not downvoted anyone in this thread. I do not censor other people’s opinions, however misguided I personally consider them. Apparently you do like to tape mask over the faces of people you disagree with.
You are getting lost in the claims and counter-claims. Their claim was that “Muslims are not more violent than non-Muslims”. Your claim is about who is committing terrorism. That is not the same thing.
The terrorist statistics have always skewed towards nationalists - but that is on the widest definition of terrorism. Arsons, letter bombs, and the like. But not the deaths caused by terrorism, which is what most ordinary folk are thinking about. That is Islamists, and has been for years. You should know that already, you seem well-informed. I will not speculate about your motives in ignoring it.
But now I am getting sidetracked too. My argument was about Islam versus other religions. And there, I’m afraid to say that the statistics are clear as day. And again, you both must know this already.